That's part of trading ... I get it, I'm venting here too
at time s... ... but for me trading is more managing risk now
than hypothetical profits ... you manage risk properly
, profits will come in steady ... I used to swing for the
fence all the time with oversized position and getting striked out
many times ... I had wild swings in my equity curve, large draw
down, etc.... now it's the opposite ...i look to constantly
hit singles and doubles ... but i'm always in the game ... I
want a steady increasing equity curve, without any wild swings ...
and I sleep much better at night
Posted by elementsix on 12th of Jan 2024 at 10:29 am
URA - Few comments on Dividend Stocks...
1. Be careful on stocks with
Dividends. Different charts handle the ex-div and
date payable in different manners. In the case of URA, the STS
tables show a
gap down in price on the ex-div date (12/28)
but other charting will resolve that when the dividend pays out
(stockcharts). When you are ex-div, simply add in the dividend
amount to calculate the actual dollar value. You can see on
stockcharts that URA had an Ex-div high of $28.55, and the low
never fell below the previous low of $26.61. We basically never
fell out of tht uptrend channel, just touched the bottom (where I
bought more because i felt the Div confuse a lot of people,
affecting price).
2. I use a higher low stop method similar to what Matt and Steve
suggest to protect profits. However, on larger swings or trades i
am more confident in, I will set an alert for the recent higher low
but
set my stop at the second higher low to allow
for more wiggle room. That totally depends upon my trade plan
though.
Thank you, elementsix, that is a good explanation of how to
handle stocks with dividend payouts. In my case, I didn't even know
it paid a dividend, I was just trading on technical indicators and
Matt's opinion. So, it was dumb luck for me, but now I know
better!
The info Matt posted abouts URA dividends says that the
dividends are paid semi-annually. However, there was no payout in
June 2023. I'll be alert in June 2024! :-)
most of the masses are more concerned with profits or potential
profits and NOT risk. Over the years I've seen more people
get more frustrated and angry about missing a strong move up in a
stock, than they do about taking a big loss on a position.
That's backwards
Another way to think about your trades is who much you are
willing to risk: So if in your trading account you are willing to
risk $250 per trade, as long as you know where your initial stop
is, you can calculate how many shares you can buy based on your
risk if you are stopped out, if the stop is hit you lose $250, your
risk is predefined.
for example if there's a stock that you see a coil on and your
entry would be $22 and you determined that your initial stop should
be placed at the most recent higher low of $21, that's $1 risk, so
that means you should buy 250 shares if that's the amount you are
willing to risk on the trade. And all of you should be
setting initial stops, otherwise you can fall into a bad
psychological trap if it goes against you where you get emotional
and are no longer objective
read this part from my book on stops:
Whenever you buy a stock, always have an exit strategy
and immediately place a stop. First off you need to know where your
stop is in order to calculate your risk/reward ratio.
Don’t fall trap to the ‘I’ll just give it a little
more room trap’.
This is an emotional rabbit hole that can happen
whenever you buy a stock and then do not immediately or soon
thereafter place a hard stop loss order. If the stock goes up
nicely after you buy it, you generally don’t have a problem,
however if the stock goes against you, and you don’t have a hard
stop loss in place, that’s where you can fall into this trap. For
example, let’s say you buy a stock at $10 and it falls to $9.5
where you might have had a psychological stop in mind but that
wasn’t live. Since you didn’t have it as a live stop order in
place (or you did but decided to cancel it) it becomes easy to
justify an excuse why you can give it a bit more room, the stock
falls more, you give it just a bit more room once again, this
continues and repeats and soon you are down 10%, 20%, 30%, 40% and
at a huge loss. Especially for swing trading it’s best to place
your stop order immediately after you enter a trade and then adhere
to that order if it looks like it’s going to be filled, let
yourself stop out. Remember, stocks are not spouses, you are not
married to them, if stopped out you can simply buy them back again
after the chart sets up again to a good risk/reward setup. Steve
and I stop out of positions all the time, simply to buy them back
again soon after.
You might tell me that you’ve heard some traders say
that they don’t use stop losses. Yes, I know quite a few
exceptional day traders who don’t place stops. However, first
and foremost they are extremely disciplined, and secondly for their
style of fast trading it might be less advantageous to use stop
orders and instead manually exit the trade on their own. For
swing trading especially, the best practice is to immediately set
your live stop order immediately after you enter the trade.
Remember my rule, always know your exit price before you even buy
the stock!
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So frustrating! I sold my
Nice pop on URA.
Posted by frtaylor on 12th of Jan 2024 at 09:42 am
So frustrating! I sold my position based on the STS stop being hit.
That's part of trading ...
Posted by mla127 on 12th of Jan 2024 at 10:01 am
That's part of trading ... I get it, I'm venting here too at time s... ... but for me trading is more managing risk now than hypothetical profits ... you manage risk properly , profits will come in steady ... I used to swing for the fence all the time with oversized position and getting striked out many times ... I had wild swings in my equity curve, large draw down, etc.... now it's the opposite ...i look to constantly hit singles and doubles ... but i'm always in the game ... I want a steady increasing equity curve, without any wild swings ... and I sleep much better at night
URA - Few comments on
Posted by elementsix on 12th of Jan 2024 at 10:29 am
URA - Few comments on Dividend Stocks...
1. Be careful on stocks with Dividends. Different charts handle the ex-div and date payable in different manners. In the case of URA, the STS tables show a gap down in price on the ex-div date (12/28) but other charting will resolve that when the dividend pays out (stockcharts). When you are ex-div, simply add in the dividend amount to calculate the actual dollar value. You can see on stockcharts that URA had an Ex-div high of $28.55, and the low never fell below the previous low of $26.61. We basically never fell out of tht uptrend channel, just touched the bottom (where I bought more because i felt the Div confuse a lot of people, affecting price).
2. I use a higher low stop method similar to what Matt and Steve suggest to protect profits. However, on larger swings or trades i am more confident in, I will set an alert for the recent higher low but set my stop at the second higher low to allow for more wiggle room. That totally depends upon my trade plan though.
Thank you, elementsix, that is
Posted by chuckw on 12th of Jan 2024 at 10:47 am
Thank you, elementsix, that is a good explanation of how to handle stocks with dividend payouts. In my case, I didn't even know it paid a dividend, I was just trading on technical indicators and Matt's opinion. So, it was dumb luck for me, but now I know better!
The info Matt posted abouts URA dividends says that the dividends are paid semi-annually. However, there was no payout in June 2023. I'll be alert in June 2024! :-)
yep, anyway that's awesome! a
Posted by matt on 12th of Jan 2024 at 10:49 am
yep, anyway that's awesome! a nice gift that you weren't expecting! congrats
that's how I approach it
Posted by matt on 12th of Jan 2024 at 10:11 am
that's how I approach it too, managing risk.
most of the masses are more concerned with profits or potential profits and NOT risk. Over the years I've seen more people get more frustrated and angry about missing a strong move up in a stock, than they do about taking a big loss on a position. That's backwards
Another way to think about your trades is who much you are willing to risk: So if in your trading account you are willing to risk $250 per trade, as long as you know where your initial stop is, you can calculate how many shares you can buy based on your risk if you are stopped out, if the stop is hit you lose $250, your risk is predefined.
for example if there's a stock that you see a coil on and your entry would be $22 and you determined that your initial stop should be placed at the most recent higher low of $21, that's $1 risk, so that means you should buy 250 shares if that's the amount you are willing to risk on the trade. And all of you should be setting initial stops, otherwise you can fall into a bad psychological trap if it goes against you where you get emotional and are no longer objective
read this part from my book on stops:
Whenever you buy a stock, always have an exit strategy and immediately place a stop. First off you need to know where your stop is in order to calculate your risk/reward ratio.
Don’t fall trap to the ‘I’ll just give it a little more room trap’.
This is an emotional rabbit hole that can happen whenever you buy a stock and then do not immediately or soon thereafter place a hard stop loss order. If the stock goes up nicely after you buy it, you generally don’t have a problem, however if the stock goes against you, and you don’t have a hard stop loss in place, that’s where you can fall into this trap. For example, let’s say you buy a stock at $10 and it falls to $9.5 where you might have had a psychological stop in mind but that wasn’t live. Since you didn’t have it as a live stop order in place (or you did but decided to cancel it) it becomes easy to justify an excuse why you can give it a bit more room, the stock falls more, you give it just a bit more room once again, this continues and repeats and soon you are down 10%, 20%, 30%, 40% and at a huge loss. Especially for swing trading it’s best to place your stop order immediately after you enter a trade and then adhere to that order if it looks like it’s going to be filled, let yourself stop out. Remember, stocks are not spouses, you are not married to them, if stopped out you can simply buy them back again after the chart sets up again to a good risk/reward setup. Steve and I stop out of positions all the time, simply to buy them back again soon after.
You might tell me that you’ve heard some traders say that they don’t use stop losses. Yes, I know quite a few exceptional day traders who don’t place stops. However, first and foremost they are extremely disciplined, and secondly for their style of fast trading it might be less advantageous to use stop orders and instead manually exit the trade on their own. For swing trading especially, the best practice is to immediately set your live stop order immediately after you enter the trade. Remember my rule, always know your exit price before you even buy the stock!