I've read the "Spy system alert important" post by Matt about 50
times. If this post was supposed to tell me to buy 20% last night
if the SPY closed below 133.48 and then sell the entire 60% this
morning on the open, then that is not what it says. The use of the
word "otherwise" always implies another alternative.
Perhaps you folks think that I'm just dumb, but this is the
second time we've had problems with communication of positions.
This time I read all I could on this site and followed the
instructions, only to find that this post doesn't mean what it
says. Having now returned from hospital duty I find that this
muddled post has cost me real money.
Posted by talleyrand on 17th of May 2011 at 08:16 am
"Hello matt,
I am confused. Yesterday you told us to go long with
another 20 % at the end of day, then close position today at
open.
Now I read "
otherwise
the sell condition for tomorrows open is in
effect"
This means that the closing of position was
conditional. Only if we did not enter long
yesterday... And as we did enter long, there is no closing of
position today.
Just for any last minute confusion. Both the systems will
be closing out all current longs on the open, not pre-market but
the official open (bells ringing etc.). If your following the
system you will want to close out all positions.
There was also some confusion about well the Single is doing
this but what about the Multi? I felt as though Matt properly
explained what both are doing but I also understand this is the
first sell signal now and with going long and selling at the open
there was some questions. A trick to understanding this is
both system should open and close at the same time. So to my
understanding, the Single entry should always match the 40% entry
of the Multi System and they should both close at the same
time. The differences come in-between where the Multi can
average down on a position but there shouldn't be a case where the
Single system sell and the Multi stays long etc. This is
because the systems both use the same methodology for initiating
and closing trades but again the Multi just uses the option of
scaling into positions based on another rubric.
Now I know posted recently were 2-3 trades where someone thought
there was a deviation in the days, we will look further into that
but everything should match.
Lastly, please feel free to PM or email
(thomas@breakpointtrades.com) me with any questions but realize I
check emails much more frequently than PMs so I am noticing a bunch
in my inbox from yesterday and for any of you I will be working
through those and getting back with you this morning.
I do not think it is that hard to understand. If you are a
single entry player then stay long your position. If you are a
multi entry player then add to your position. There will not be a
sell on the open for any position tomorrow. ( at least this
is my take )
You have not indicated a long or short position. Based on this
market condition I would think you are advising a short position on
the 20% and you have not specified.
Posted by xxnileshxx on 16th of May 2011 at 03:52 pm
Was wondering is the second entry for Multi entry system and the
sell for single entry system. Or is the sell signal negated and we
only have a second entry?
I don't think that's what it means, but Matt can confirm when he
backs back from the doctor's office. I could be wrong, but I read
it as if SPY closes below 133.48, then scale in for the second
entry. But I don't think it means that we sell the 60% at the open
tomorrow.
If it doesn't close below 133.48, then sell the 40% (1st
scale-in) long tomorrow at the open.
My understanding is that there are two sets of instructions
depending on whether you're following the single system or multi
system. If you're following the single system, sell on open
tomorrow. If you're following the multi system, add 20%
today and keep until further notice.
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SPY system alert IMPORTANT
Posted by matt on 16th of May 2011 at 03:42 pm
The multi entry system will scale into its second entry today at the close for an additional 20% of it's intended position (60% total).
SPY needs to close below a price of 133.48 in order to meet this requirement.
otherwise the sell condition for tomorrows open is in effect
continued confusion
Posted by chrshale on 17th of May 2011 at 11:51 am
I've read the "Spy system alert important" post by Matt about 50 times. If this post was supposed to tell me to buy 20% last night if the SPY closed below 133.48 and then sell the entire 60% this morning on the open, then that is not what it says. The use of the word "otherwise" always implies another alternative.
Perhaps you folks think that I'm just dumb, but this is the second time we've had problems with communication of positions. This time I read all I could on this site and followed the instructions, only to find that this post doesn't mean what it says. Having now returned from hospital duty I find that this muddled post has cost me real money.
I think it would be
Posted by ascr on 17th of May 2011 at 12:44 pm
I think it would be helpful for everyone if BPT could follow a template for the system trade notification posts. Something like:
SPY system comments
Posted by matt on 17th of May 2011 at 02:34 pm
ascr - thanks, that's a nice base to start with, I'll think about it a bit before I decide something that is hard set and we are locked into.
My pleasure Matt. Thanks again
Posted by ascr on 17th of May 2011 at 02:54 pm
My pleasure Matt. Thanks again for such an incredible opportunity. I'm looking forward to the close today. Exciting stuff.
I like this type of
Posted by ggoodrich on 17th of May 2011 at 12:58 pm
I like this type of format as well, nice job ascr
This is a good suggestion and should save Matt time...
Posted by lessarda on 17th of May 2011 at 12:51 pm
Matt specifically said sell both systems on his 4:10 post yesterday...hell, it was underlined!
Posted by marketguy on 17th of May 2011 at 12:39 pm
Crystal clear
Posted by trader8 on 17th of May 2011 at 12:49 pm
Agree. 4.10 message was CRYSTAL CLEAR to me. Thanks for all of the good work, Matt.
SImply?? DO we sell the single entry at the open?????
Posted by rgaiti on 17th of May 2011 at 09:07 am
YES. WE sell the signle
Posted by parkridge77 on 17th of May 2011 at 09:23 am
YES. WE sell the signle entry position at open
yes sell single at open
Posted by onoffon on 17th of May 2011 at 09:08 am
"otherwise the sell condition for tomorrows open is in effect"
Posted by talleyrand on 17th of May 2011 at 08:16 am
"Hello matt,
I am confused. Yesterday you told us to go long with another 20 % at the end of day, then close position today at open.
Now I read " otherwise the sell condition for tomorrows open is in effect"
This means that the closing of position was conditional. Only if we did not enter long yesterday... And as we did enter long, there is no closing of position today.
Did I get it right?
talletrand -- no you did
Posted by Michael on 17th of May 2011 at 08:39 am
talletrand -- no you did not get it right. matt often uses the word "otherwise" to mean "meanwhile" or "in any case".
hasn't this post answered your question?
Posted by biketastic on 17th of May 2011 at 08:34 am
http://breakpointtrades.com/blog/post/158067/#158087
@Michael and @biketastic
Posted by talleyrand on 17th of May 2011 at 08:44 am
Thanks for clarifying: Sell position at today's open.
The words "otherwise" and "sell condition" confused me, as I am not a native english speaker, I am afraid of misunderstandings ...
This Morning's Signal
Posted by tom on 17th of May 2011 at 09:12 am
Thank you for answering those tallyrand.
Just for any last minute confusion. Both the systems will be closing out all current longs on the open, not pre-market but the official open (bells ringing etc.). If your following the system you will want to close out all positions.
There was also some confusion about well the Single is doing this but what about the Multi? I felt as though Matt properly explained what both are doing but I also understand this is the first sell signal now and with going long and selling at the open there was some questions. A trick to understanding this is both system should open and close at the same time. So to my understanding, the Single entry should always match the 40% entry of the Multi System and they should both close at the same time. The differences come in-between where the Multi can average down on a position but there shouldn't be a case where the Single system sell and the Multi stays long etc. This is because the systems both use the same methodology for initiating and closing trades but again the Multi just uses the option of scaling into positions based on another rubric.
Now I know posted recently were 2-3 trades where someone thought there was a deviation in the days, we will look further into that but everything should match.
Lastly, please feel free to PM or email (thomas@breakpointtrades.com) me with any questions but realize I check emails much more frequently than PMs so I am noticing a bunch in my inbox from yesterday and for any of you I will be working through those and getting back with you this morning.
pebs, i think you are wrong. both systems exit at the same time.
Posted by gram on 16th of May 2011 at 04:11 pm
since spy closed below 133.48, we just add 20% if you are using multi entry system, if using single system, you do nothing. that's my understanding
I do not think it
Posted by randy on 16th of May 2011 at 04:11 pm
I do not think it is that hard to understand. If you are a single entry player then stay long your position. If you are a multi entry player then add to your position. There will not be a sell on the open for any position tomorrow. ( at least this is my take )
How can the one system
Posted by ronroy on 16th of May 2011 at 04:02 pm
How can the one system be selling and the other buying? Very confusing????
yes the multi entry system
Posted by matt on 16th of May 2011 at 04:12 pm
yes the multi entry system can scale in or add to it's existing trade because the system is exiting tomorrow on the open, not at the close today.
Matt, does this mean that
Posted by dfbrobst on 16th of May 2011 at 04:23 pm
Matt, does this mean that the multi entry system exits in the morning also? The system bought 20% on the close, and then sells everything at the open?
Read.....
Posted by burkmere on 16th of May 2011 at 04:30 pm
Read his first sticky...to me the entire position means the entire position. Could it mean anything else?
"HOWEVER the system will still sell the entire position tomorrow on the open."
SPY System
Posted by cooksbay on 16th of May 2011 at 04:02 pm
Whoa ... now I'm confused!
Long or short?
Posted by mossdesign on 16th of May 2011 at 03:59 pm
You have not indicated a long or short position. Based on this market condition I would think you are advising a short position on the 20% and you have not specified.
of course it's long. There
Posted by shinings on 16th of May 2011 at 04:03 pm
of course it's long. There was never mixed long and short in the same multi-entry trade.
Mossdesign - Its a second
Posted by kingpin777 on 16th of May 2011 at 04:02 pm
Mossdesign - Its a second entry. The first was long. Therefore, the second is long.
Is the second entry for multi entry and the sell for single entry?
Posted by xxnileshxx on 16th of May 2011 at 03:52 pm
Was wondering is the second entry for Multi entry system and the sell for single entry system. Or is the sell signal negated and we only have a second entry?
So if we scale in
Posted by 24kau on 16th of May 2011 at 03:46 pm
So if we scale in 20% at close today, we sell the ENTIRE 60% position on the open tomorrow, correct?
I don't think that's what
Posted by cw12 on 16th of May 2011 at 03:55 pm
I don't think that's what it means, but Matt can confirm when he backs back from the doctor's office. I could be wrong, but I read it as if SPY closes below 133.48, then scale in for the second entry. But I don't think it means that we sell the 60% at the open tomorrow.
If it doesn't close below 133.48, then sell the 40% (1st scale-in) long tomorrow at the open.
that doesn't seem right? if
Posted by stockjock34 on 16th of May 2011 at 03:55 pm
that doesn't seem right? if i bought 40% i buy more at close, while single entry point sells on open?
No. If it scales in
Posted by kingpin777 on 16th of May 2011 at 03:54 pm
No. If it scales in today, it would cancel the sell condition for tomorrow
Pebs, that's my understanding too,
Posted by dfbrobst on 16th of May 2011 at 04:09 pm
Pebs, that's my understanding too, though i hadn't seen this in any of the charts prior.
My understanding is that there
Posted by pebs on 16th of May 2011 at 04:02 pm
My understanding is that there are two sets of instructions depending on whether you're following the single system or multi system. If you're following the single system, sell on open tomorrow. If you're following the multi system, add 20% today and keep until further notice.